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	<title>Comments on: The Spiritual Benefits of Being Pissy</title>
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		<title>By: Oops, anger</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29325</link>
		<dc:creator>Oops, anger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Jun 2009 16:18:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29325</guid>
		<description>[...] Magpie Girl wrote a post recently that I can&#8217;t get out of my mind. About anger. Yes, ANGER. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Magpie Girl wrote a post recently that I can&#8217;t get out of my mind. About anger. Yes, ANGER. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Deborah VanDetta</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29291</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah VanDetta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 15:50:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I feel like anger has been a constant in my life.  And I was never given a positive way to express it.  I was raised in a family of women - passive-aggressiveness and guilt were how they expressed anger.  I am blessed to have a husband who has taught me and is still teaching me to SAY what I feel, what I need and be direct and clear.  Very long learning curve on that.

I also love your visualization of anger as a stone to be lifted.  I think that will be so helpful for me, to understand where my anger comes from, why it escapes into rage.  Thankfully as I&#039;ve grown I have learned to control my violent physical explosions, and for me medication for depression and anxiety was a huge part of that.  For negative thinking I use &quot;That is a story that does not need to happen.&quot;  Now I can add &quot;What is under this stone of anger? to my emotional toolbox.

Thank you for another thought-provoking and valuable post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel like anger has been a constant in my life.  And I was never given a positive way to express it.  I was raised in a family of women &#8211; passive-aggressiveness and guilt were how they expressed anger.  I am blessed to have a husband who has taught me and is still teaching me to SAY what I feel, what I need and be direct and clear.  Very long learning curve on that.</p>
<p>I also love your visualization of anger as a stone to be lifted.  I think that will be so helpful for me, to understand where my anger comes from, why it escapes into rage.  Thankfully as I&#8217;ve grown I have learned to control my violent physical explosions, and for me medication for depression and anxiety was a huge part of that.  For negative thinking I use &#8220;That is a story that does not need to happen.&#8221;  Now I can add &#8220;What is under this stone of anger? to my emotional toolbox.</p>
<p>Thank you for another thought-provoking and valuable post.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29290</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 15:09:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29290</guid>
		<description>It is so hard to learn healthy ways to be angry, and yes, to even acknowledge that being angry is okay. Even now, I try to verbalize my anger (even in &quot;inappropriate&quot; ways, considering I have a little one but he&#039;s not so big on the speaking yet) instead of doing it my mother&#039;s way (slamming cabinet doors, huffing and puffing and then having one big blowup that clouds up the whole house). I am still not sure if it&#039;s better for my husband and I to fight in front of our kid or wait until later. 

As for anger within in the church, it still BOGGLES my mind and heart that women MY AGE (I&#039;m thirty, for goodness sake) and younger so easily accept the &quot;your man is  your overlord&quot; philosophy. Or men in general - that&#039;s why I cannot in good faith attend a church that doesn&#039;t let women participate in ministry - it&#039;s ridiculous. I remember the moment where I realized that I &quot;knew more&quot; than my pastor as far as Old Testament knowledge went - and realized that I didn&#039;t have &quot;authority&quot; to say what I knew in front our of congregation. That&#039;s when I was done, so to speak. 

I know they justify it with scripture, and I know many men only want to do good by their wives, but there&#039;s also that handful that enjoy their &quot;authority&quot; far too much. But I can&#039;t get over it. I honestly believe that by doing this, we put so much pressure on our men, to DIE for us? To have all the answers? One morning in Bible study another woman confessed to not feeling ready to have a 2nd child, but her husband felt that they should, and so she was &#039;submitting&#039; to his wisdom. I looked at her in disbelief. 

That said, I&#039;m all about a wonderful partnership, and I trust my husband to make good decisions for our family, even sacrifice for our well-being, just as I do for us. I could write about this for days, and maybe I will...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is so hard to learn healthy ways to be angry, and yes, to even acknowledge that being angry is okay. Even now, I try to verbalize my anger (even in &#8220;inappropriate&#8221; ways, considering I have a little one but he&#8217;s not so big on the speaking yet) instead of doing it my mother&#8217;s way (slamming cabinet doors, huffing and puffing and then having one big blowup that clouds up the whole house). I am still not sure if it&#8217;s better for my husband and I to fight in front of our kid or wait until later. </p>
<p>As for anger within in the church, it still BOGGLES my mind and heart that women MY AGE (I&#8217;m thirty, for goodness sake) and younger so easily accept the &#8220;your man is  your overlord&#8221; philosophy. Or men in general &#8211; that&#8217;s why I cannot in good faith attend a church that doesn&#8217;t let women participate in ministry &#8211; it&#8217;s ridiculous. I remember the moment where I realized that I &#8220;knew more&#8221; than my pastor as far as Old Testament knowledge went &#8211; and realized that I didn&#8217;t have &#8220;authority&#8221; to say what I knew in front our of congregation. That&#8217;s when I was done, so to speak. </p>
<p>I know they justify it with scripture, and I know many men only want to do good by their wives, but there&#8217;s also that handful that enjoy their &#8220;authority&#8221; far too much. But I can&#8217;t get over it. I honestly believe that by doing this, we put so much pressure on our men, to DIE for us? To have all the answers? One morning in Bible study another woman confessed to not feeling ready to have a 2nd child, but her husband felt that they should, and so she was &#8217;submitting&#8217; to his wisdom. I looked at her in disbelief. </p>
<p>That said, I&#8217;m all about a wonderful partnership, and I trust my husband to make good decisions for our family, even sacrifice for our well-being, just as I do for us. I could write about this for days, and maybe I will&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Bethany</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29289</link>
		<dc:creator>Bethany</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 14:57:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29289</guid>
		<description>Anger is a subject that has consistently come up this past year in my journal and in those late-night soul conversations with my husband. Even as so many areas of my life have found healing, anger continues to dominate some days, and I&#039;m usually clueless about how to treat it. I love your idea of visualizing it as a stone and looking at what it&#039;s hiding; I will be trying that next time for sure. 
  And as for the religious requirement to be sweet, stoic, and un-confrontational as women... GRRRR.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anger is a subject that has consistently come up this past year in my journal and in those late-night soul conversations with my husband. Even as so many areas of my life have found healing, anger continues to dominate some days, and I&#8217;m usually clueless about how to treat it. I love your idea of visualizing it as a stone and looking at what it&#8217;s hiding; I will be trying that next time for sure.<br />
  And as for the religious requirement to be sweet, stoic, and un-confrontational as women&#8230; GRRRR.</p>
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		<title>By: Abbey of the Arts</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29288</link>
		<dc:creator>Abbey of the Arts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 14:21:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29288</guid>
		<description>This is great Rachelle, I love your reflection and the very wise comments that follow here.  Funny thing is that I was raised in a household that wasn&#039;t the least bit religious, but I wasn&#039;t allowed to express anger either or any strong emotion.  Churches do a great job of shrouding that with religious language which adds power to the stifling. But I have also spent much of my adult years learning how to express my anger and like rowena, I still have problems with confrontation. 

One day I am going to write a book about the spirituality of doubt, despair, &amp; desolation and explore some of the great mystics and saints who write about the how essential these experiences are in our journey toward the sacred.  I&#039;d love to see your book on the spirituality of anger right next to it on the shelf.  Better yet, the pages open wide across the laps of women everywhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is great Rachelle, I love your reflection and the very wise comments that follow here.  Funny thing is that I was raised in a household that wasn&#8217;t the least bit religious, but I wasn&#8217;t allowed to express anger either or any strong emotion.  Churches do a great job of shrouding that with religious language which adds power to the stifling. But I have also spent much of my adult years learning how to express my anger and like rowena, I still have problems with confrontation. </p>
<p>One day I am going to write a book about the spirituality of doubt, despair, &amp; desolation and explore some of the great mystics and saints who write about the how essential these experiences are in our journey toward the sacred.  I&#8217;d love to see your book on the spirituality of anger right next to it on the shelf.  Better yet, the pages open wide across the laps of women everywhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Phyllis Mathis</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29286</link>
		<dc:creator>Phyllis Mathis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 14:11:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29286</guid>
		<description>Rachelle,
Excellent post. I agree that being pissy - owning and rightly expressing anger - is essential to spirituality. When I was in a religious system that was more phony than real, I figured somebody should be angry about it. I had a feeling God might be a little pissed to be misrepresented that way. I knew I couldn&#039;t keep quiet and play nice any more. So I blogged about it. Something about breaking the no-talk rule was spiritually cleansing and empowering for me. Thanks for  bringing this into the light, Rachelle. It&#039;s essential.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rachelle,<br />
Excellent post. I agree that being pissy &#8211; owning and rightly expressing anger &#8211; is essential to spirituality. When I was in a religious system that was more phony than real, I figured somebody should be angry about it. I had a feeling God might be a little pissed to be misrepresented that way. I knew I couldn&#8217;t keep quiet and play nice any more. So I blogged about it. Something about breaking the no-talk rule was spiritually cleansing and empowering for me. Thanks for  bringing this into the light, Rachelle. It&#8217;s essential.</p>
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		<title>By: rowena</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29285</link>
		<dc:creator>rowena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 13:40:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29285</guid>
		<description>Very interesting and much to think about.  Sometimes I think the creative and spiritual blog world wants everything to be shiny and pretty, too.  It has to be all positive and supportive, without realizing that being pissy a little, that being critical can be more supportive than just saying that everything is wonderful.  A debate might serve more purpose than fawning over how wonderful a blogger is.  Authenticity over Perfection.  Perfection is so destructive, in my opinion.

I suppose I am firmly placed within the post modern culture.  I definitely value transparency and authenticity.  I was raised a Buddhist, not Christian at all, although I do remember that we were expected to convert people, even as children.  I would suppose that&#039;s  one of the reasons I left.

But I was also trained as a girl to not make a ruckus, to not be angry, to not set my unstable father off.  

I still have problems with confrontation.  I have to consciously choose to confront an issue. And for some reason, I ended up with a partner who has anger issues. 

Sometimes I think life puts in front of us the challenges we need to overcome in order to be our highest selves.  

It&#039;s really annoying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting and much to think about.  Sometimes I think the creative and spiritual blog world wants everything to be shiny and pretty, too.  It has to be all positive and supportive, without realizing that being pissy a little, that being critical can be more supportive than just saying that everything is wonderful.  A debate might serve more purpose than fawning over how wonderful a blogger is.  Authenticity over Perfection.  Perfection is so destructive, in my opinion.</p>
<p>I suppose I am firmly placed within the post modern culture.  I definitely value transparency and authenticity.  I was raised a Buddhist, not Christian at all, although I do remember that we were expected to convert people, even as children.  I would suppose that&#8217;s  one of the reasons I left.</p>
<p>But I was also trained as a girl to not make a ruckus, to not be angry, to not set my unstable father off.  </p>
<p>I still have problems with confrontation.  I have to consciously choose to confront an issue. And for some reason, I ended up with a partner who has anger issues. </p>
<p>Sometimes I think life puts in front of us the challenges we need to overcome in order to be our highest selves.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s really annoying.</p>
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		<title>By: Tori</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29284</link>
		<dc:creator>Tori</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 12:36:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29284</guid>
		<description>The more I communicate with other people, the more I realize that I have a very odd family. I’m not even sure how to explain my family to most people. There is my mom, dad, little sister &amp; me family, where we could be seen as perfectly normal. Then there is my whole FAMILY, all the people I grew up with/around. This includes all the aunts, uncles, cousins, and grandparents who I am very close to. When people look at them they have to be thinking “This explains so much….” 

In my small little mom, dad, sister family I got the regular dose of ‘responsibility’, ‘good behavior’, ‘don’t talk back’, etc. etc., even without a church influence. (I’ve never attended church.) But, I didn’t spend much time at home as a child. Both my parents worked so I spent my before school hours, after school hours, and summers with the other members of my family. Here is where I learned the facts of life. My most important life lessons were learned during this time spent away from my mom and dad- including how to express anger. 

All my cousins bit, hit, threw stuff, chased, pinched, and generally hurt each other out of anger. And someone was always angry at someone else. My aunt was a busy person and did not have time to constantly supervise us. When she found out about the hitting and throwing stuff, kids were punished by being spanked or yelled at. I grew up thinking that physical contact and yelling were perfectly valid ways to express anger.

I picked up these bad habits and I am still trying to shake them. When I get angry I still have a hard time not hitting. At home I was still told ‘don’t hit’ and ‘don’t fight with your sister’. Luckily these lessons are the ones that I am trying to live by. When I do hit someone out of anger I immediately regret it and hate myself for not paying attention to what I’m doing. I cry when I am angry. I cry because I don’t know how to deal with how I’m feeling. Hopefully I’ll learn how to express my anger better, I’m working on it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The more I communicate with other people, the more I realize that I have a very odd family. I’m not even sure how to explain my family to most people. There is my mom, dad, little sister &amp; me family, where we could be seen as perfectly normal. Then there is my whole FAMILY, all the people I grew up with/around. This includes all the aunts, uncles, cousins, and grandparents who I am very close to. When people look at them they have to be thinking “This explains so much….” </p>
<p>In my small little mom, dad, sister family I got the regular dose of ‘responsibility’, ‘good behavior’, ‘don’t talk back’, etc. etc., even without a church influence. (I’ve never attended church.) But, I didn’t spend much time at home as a child. Both my parents worked so I spent my before school hours, after school hours, and summers with the other members of my family. Here is where I learned the facts of life. My most important life lessons were learned during this time spent away from my mom and dad- including how to express anger. </p>
<p>All my cousins bit, hit, threw stuff, chased, pinched, and generally hurt each other out of anger. And someone was always angry at someone else. My aunt was a busy person and did not have time to constantly supervise us. When she found out about the hitting and throwing stuff, kids were punished by being spanked or yelled at. I grew up thinking that physical contact and yelling were perfectly valid ways to express anger.</p>
<p>I picked up these bad habits and I am still trying to shake them. When I get angry I still have a hard time not hitting. At home I was still told ‘don’t hit’ and ‘don’t fight with your sister’. Luckily these lessons are the ones that I am trying to live by. When I do hit someone out of anger I immediately regret it and hate myself for not paying attention to what I’m doing. I cry when I am angry. I cry because I don’t know how to deal with how I’m feeling. Hopefully I’ll learn how to express my anger better, I’m working on it.</p>
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		<title>By: Kel</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29283</link>
		<dc:creator>Kel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 11:53:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29283</guid>
		<description>Rachelle, the title of this post is just gorgeous and the message hits a home run for me. As someone who sits squarely in the midst of both groups you minister to [soulful creatives and the malcontents club] your ability to &#039;name&#039; the things that have hugely impacted my life journey is stunning. 

I used to write for and edit denominational publications. My words were forever tempered to fit the &#039;lady-like&#039; mode you speak of. One day I realised my very life was being edited to fit within that mold.  Authenticity was such a strong core value for me that I had to walk away from it all. Right when my talents were being recognised and I was being head-hunted for overseas publications.

I was also involved in youth ministry and introducing soulful creative spiritual spaces and practices that pomo gens relate well to. The kids loved it but the &#039;authorities&#039; squashed it, fearing things unknown, calling those activities and me things we are not.

To answer your questions: I have not found a way to express anger within a conservative religious construct. When trying to write pissy, in a ladylike manner, all I ended up with was prissy :-)

A breakthrough for me in dealing with anger has been to process things through creative arts therapy. To move away from words (the preferred church communication method), and into images, symbols, sounds, movement. More recently I have been doing some work with &#039;toning&#039; and it is profoundly healing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rachelle, the title of this post is just gorgeous and the message hits a home run for me. As someone who sits squarely in the midst of both groups you minister to [soulful creatives and the malcontents club] your ability to &#8216;name&#8217; the things that have hugely impacted my life journey is stunning. </p>
<p>I used to write for and edit denominational publications. My words were forever tempered to fit the &#8216;lady-like&#8217; mode you speak of. One day I realised my very life was being edited to fit within that mold.  Authenticity was such a strong core value for me that I had to walk away from it all. Right when my talents were being recognised and I was being head-hunted for overseas publications.</p>
<p>I was also involved in youth ministry and introducing soulful creative spiritual spaces and practices that pomo gens relate well to. The kids loved it but the &#8216;authorities&#8217; squashed it, fearing things unknown, calling those activities and me things we are not.</p>
<p>To answer your questions: I have not found a way to express anger within a conservative religious construct. When trying to write pissy, in a ladylike manner, all I ended up with was prissy :-)</p>
<p>A breakthrough for me in dealing with anger has been to process things through creative arts therapy. To move away from words (the preferred church communication method), and into images, symbols, sounds, movement. More recently I have been doing some work with &#8216;toning&#8217; and it is profoundly healing.</p>
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		<title>By: Tess</title>
		<link>http://www.magpie-girl.com/20090531/the-spiritual-benefits-of-being-pissy/comment-page-1/#comment-29282</link>
		<dc:creator>Tess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 10:26:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.magpie-girl.com/?p=1760#comment-29282</guid>
		<description>Oh where to start? I think my background in the Roman Catholic church in England is similar to the evangelical and fundamentalist Christianity you describe. Certainly similar in terms of girls being expected to be ladylike. It&#039;s all our fault, you see. We are guilty of tempting boys to sin; they can&#039;t help themselves. (I was told this categorically by a priest when I was about 11.) 

And I think there was also a more subtle dynamic going on in the community in which I was raised. Women were expected to be educated. We were expected to be bright. Being a bluestocking was as acceptable as being a wife and mother, a nun or a teacher. But women were not expected to express their intelligence in any way that would rock the boat. It was as if intellectual arguments could be made (although not against the fundamentals of the church), but they must be made in a bloodless, cool way. No anger, no guts.

And for me, at least, all the anger swelling and surging behind that seawall of expectations has often spilled back onto my self. I&#039;ve stuffed the feelings back with food and other poisons. I&#039;ve been paralysed into non-action or distracted by relentless action.

It&#039;s really only quite recently, in my early fifties, that I realised how deep it all runs and I&#039;m still searching for ways to express it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh where to start? I think my background in the Roman Catholic church in England is similar to the evangelical and fundamentalist Christianity you describe. Certainly similar in terms of girls being expected to be ladylike. It&#8217;s all our fault, you see. We are guilty of tempting boys to sin; they can&#8217;t help themselves. (I was told this categorically by a priest when I was about 11.) </p>
<p>And I think there was also a more subtle dynamic going on in the community in which I was raised. Women were expected to be educated. We were expected to be bright. Being a bluestocking was as acceptable as being a wife and mother, a nun or a teacher. But women were not expected to express their intelligence in any way that would rock the boat. It was as if intellectual arguments could be made (although not against the fundamentals of the church), but they must be made in a bloodless, cool way. No anger, no guts.</p>
<p>And for me, at least, all the anger swelling and surging behind that seawall of expectations has often spilled back onto my self. I&#8217;ve stuffed the feelings back with food and other poisons. I&#8217;ve been paralysed into non-action or distracted by relentless action.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s really only quite recently, in my early fifties, that I realised how deep it all runs and I&#8217;m still searching for ways to express it.</p>
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