Comments on: Abstinence, Kids, and Faith: Thoughts from the Comment Gallery http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/ distracted by sparkly things since 1969 Fri, 03 Feb 2012 23:58:52 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.3 By: Kathleen Botsford http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-8932 Kathleen Botsford Fri, 04 Jul 2008 19:16:15 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-8932 It is no coincidence I happened upon your blog this morning. Your writing is brilliant and wise and I plan to visit often. I was shocked that post ran 1,000 words! I inhaled it in a mere moment! I am the mother of three fabulous children, Alexandra freshly 21, Stephen 19 and Victoria 15. Alexandra studied last semester in Italy and before she left we had her first appointment with a gynecologist and received a prescription for birth control. Scary thing indeed for this Mom! Since she has not had a steady boyfriend as of yet, this has not been an issue but things they are a changing! A few evenings ago, we girls had dinner with a friend of mine who both of the girls respect and look up to. As mothers know, sometimes our children take the advice of strangers a bit more to heart than their mothers who may be just a little too close during those confusing adolescent years. I have always encouraged my children to forge relationships with appropriate adults as I realize there may be things they do not want to discuss with their father or myself and a trusted adult friend can fill that space with love and concern for their welfare also. The subject of sex arose and my friend rather flippantly seemed to condone casual sex with the physical act as an end in and of itself. I was stunned to say the least. I believe sex is indeed a Sacred act. It is the merging together of more than two bodies, it is the intermingling of two Souls. I believe you leave a part of your spirit with every person you have a intimate relationship with and a sexual relationship is intensely and immediately intimate whether it is acknowledged or not. Sex has the ability to heal as well as to destroy and should be entered into with full awareness of this sacred and ancient power. I too grew up in an extremely religious home. While we were Roman Catholic and attended Catholic schools through high school, the command to wait until marriage for sex was inexplicably ingrained without so much as a conversation. It was as if it had been knitted into our very bones from the beginning of time. I married the first person I was to have sex with as did most of my 6 siblings. BIG MISTAKE and so NOT the way to form a loving and successful marriage FOR ME. My early marriage lasted a few short years but I learned much about myself and how to listen to the urges of my spirit and guides through becoming one with my body. The answers are all there within. These are the lessons I try to pass on to my children but I also have to continually learn to let go of the results. They each have their individual soul journeys to navigate. Who am I to presume to know what is right for them? What lessons they came to earth this life time to learn? I can pray for them and hold them in sacred space as they learn to navigate the precarious turns and bumps they will encounter along the way. I can prepare them the best I can and then I must let go and let go and let go again. As much as it breaks my heart, they will be hurt and they will make mistakes. It is part of life. It was part of my life and it will continue to be so even as I grow more aware and hopefully wise with age. I tried to protect them from the media as much as I could in a world were they had instant access as soon as they walked out my door. In this precarious age, we are called upon to become the change we wish to see. My mission as a parent is to forge a loving bond with my children that will give them the freedom, the space and confidence to grow into the full blessedness of their soul's expression. I hope the innate need of all humans to be loved and accepted as a part of a family or community larger than themselves will be filled within our immediate family until they are of the age to fly from the nest with the maturity necessary to begin to make decisions and choices that will affect them for their entire lifetime. And I hope they will find the joy of love and beauty of sacred sex as part of their journey as young adults whether they choose to abstain or not. I hope they do not take these life choices lightly but I also hope they will find the lightness of heart and joy that can be part of this wonderful expression of our life on this planet. While The Catholic Conflicts* that were once a large part of my shadow with much influence over my inner turmoil as well as my outward choices, ultimately served me in ways I was not to understand until the reflection and contemplation that comes with awareness and possibly age. I can look back and see their only purpose was to protect me if erroneously from making decisions I would regret if not at the time, then in later years. I believe all life is a continuous circle, constantly spiraling deeper back into itself and then out again as each generation adds to the wisdom, joy and inevitable pain of our human journey to become aware of our Oneness with all creation in all directions of time and space. Sex is a magical part of that journey and when approached in this manner may be as close as some of us will get to experiencing the transcendence of the Divine in our human and ordinary daily lives. It is no coincidence I happened upon your blog this morning. Your writing is brilliant and wise and I plan to visit often. I was shocked that post ran 1,000 words! I inhaled it in a mere moment! I am the mother of three fabulous children, Alexandra freshly 21, Stephen 19 and Victoria 15. Alexandra studied last semester in Italy and before she left we had her first appointment with a gynecologist and received a prescription for birth control. Scary thing indeed for this Mom! Since she has not had a steady boyfriend as of yet, this has not been an issue but things they are a changing! A few evenings ago, we girls had dinner with a friend of mine who both of the girls respect and look up to. As mothers know, sometimes our children take the advice of strangers a bit more to heart than their mothers who may be just a little too close during those confusing adolescent years. I have always encouraged my children to forge relationships with appropriate adults as I realize there may be things they do not want to discuss with their father or myself and a trusted adult friend can fill that space with love and concern for their welfare also. The subject of sex arose and my friend rather flippantly seemed to condone casual sex with the physical act as an end in and of itself. I was stunned to say the least. I believe sex is indeed a Sacred act. It is the merging together of more than two bodies, it is the intermingling of two Souls. I believe you leave a part of your spirit with every person you have a intimate relationship with and a sexual relationship is intensely and immediately intimate whether it is acknowledged or not. Sex has the ability to heal as well as to destroy and should be entered into with full awareness of this sacred and ancient power. I too grew up in an extremely religious home. While we were Roman Catholic and attended Catholic schools through high school, the command to wait until marriage for sex was inexplicably ingrained without so much as a conversation. It was as if it had been knitted into our very bones from the beginning of time. I married the first person I was to have sex with as did most of my 6 siblings. BIG MISTAKE and so NOT the way to form a loving and successful marriage FOR ME. My early marriage lasted a few short years but I learned much about myself and how to listen to the urges of my spirit and guides through becoming one with my body. The answers are all there within. These are the lessons I try to pass on to my children but I also have to continually learn to let go of the results. They each have their individual soul journeys to navigate. Who am I to presume to know what is right for them? What lessons they came to earth this life time to learn? I can pray for them and hold them in sacred space as they learn to navigate the precarious turns and bumps they will encounter along the way. I can prepare them the best I can and then I must let go and let go and let go again. As much as it breaks my heart, they will be hurt and they will make mistakes. It is part of life. It was part of my life and it will continue to be so even as I grow more aware and hopefully wise with age. I tried to protect them from the media as much as I could in a world were they had instant access as soon as they walked out my door. In this precarious age, we are called upon to become the change we wish to see. My mission as a parent is to forge a loving bond with my children that will give them the freedom, the space and confidence to grow into the full blessedness of their soul’s expression. I hope the innate need of all humans to be loved and accepted as a part of a family or community larger than themselves will be filled within our immediate family until they are of the age to fly from the nest with the maturity necessary to begin to make decisions and choices that will affect them for their entire lifetime. And I hope they will find the joy of love and beauty of sacred sex as part of their journey as young adults whether they choose to abstain or not. I hope they do not take these life choices lightly but I also hope they will find the lightness of heart and joy that can be part of this wonderful expression of our life on this planet. While The Catholic Conflicts* that were once a large part of my shadow with much influence over my inner turmoil as well as my outward choices, ultimately served me in ways I was not to understand until the reflection and contemplation that comes with awareness and possibly age. I can look back and see their only purpose was to protect me if erroneously from making decisions I would regret if not at the time, then in later years. I believe all life is a continuous circle, constantly spiraling deeper back into itself and then out again as each generation adds to the wisdom, joy and inevitable pain of our human journey to become aware of our Oneness with all creation in all directions of time and space. Sex is a magical part of that journey and when approached in this manner may be as close as some of us will get to experiencing the transcendence of the Divine in our human and ordinary daily lives.

]]> By: Rachelle Mee-Chapman http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-8205 Rachelle Mee-Chapman Fri, 13 Jun 2008 08:28:14 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-8205 Patchouli I love the 'never settle' ring! I've seen the 'true love waits' version, of course, but the 'never settle' idea is much stronger for me. One thought about your comment...I get why you are linking babies and sex. Because of course, even the strongest birth control can stilll result in unexpected pregnancies. (Enter my second daughter, for instance.) Still, I don't know if it's realistic to say that you must be ready to share both sex and babies before you have sex. There were many many years in my marraige for instance, where I was perfectly willing to share sex, but not willing to share babies. The one does not necessitate the other, and while willingness for baby sharing grew when the reality of a second child was here, I hardly think it was necessary for me to refrain from sex with my spouse until I was willing to have another child. In a similar pairing, death is a neccessary companion of life, but one does not refrain from living because one is unwilling to engage with dying. We face into the latter possibilty as it arises, not out of willingness, but of necessity. Just some embryonic thoughts-on-the-fly... Yours on the journey, Rachelle Patchouli

I love the ‘never settle’ ring! I’ve seen the ‘true love waits’ version, of course, but the ‘never settle’ idea is much stronger for me.

One thought about your comment…I get why you are linking babies and sex. Because of course, even the strongest birth control can stilll result in unexpected pregnancies. (Enter my second daughter, for instance.)

Still, I don’t know if it’s realistic to say that you must be ready to share both sex and babies before you have sex. There were many many years in my marraige for instance, where I was perfectly willing to share sex, but not willing to share babies. The one does not necessitate the other, and while willingness for baby sharing grew when the reality of a second child was here, I hardly think it was necessary for me to refrain from sex with my spouse until I was willing to have another child.

In a similar pairing, death is a neccessary companion of life, but one does not refrain from living because one is unwilling to engage with dying. We face into the latter possibilty as it arises, not out of willingness, but of necessity.

Just some embryonic thoughts-on-the-fly…

Yours on the journey,

Rachelle

]]> By: Patchouli http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-8190 Patchouli Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:13:00 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-8190 I do have older daughters and have dealt with this issue. Like Bethany, I struggled with the messages I sent to my daughters, especially when the oldest started dating. No way did I wish guilt and shame on them, but no way did I want them to have a laissez-faire attitude either. After much thought and discussion, we settled on is this: sex is sacred, one of the most precious gifts you can share with someone. So are babies. If you are willing to share one, you should be ready to share the other. If you're not ready to share BOTH, then you are hurting yourself by allowing dishonesty. My oldest daughter was given a "NEVER SETTLE" ring by her older cousin. It's a powerful message and I am grateful that someone a little older and wiser gifted my daughter with that wisdom. I do have older daughters and have dealt with this issue. Like Bethany, I struggled with the messages I sent to my daughters, especially when the oldest started dating. No way did I wish guilt and shame on them, but no way did I want them to have a laissez-faire attitude either.
After much thought and discussion, we settled on is this: sex is sacred, one of the most precious gifts you can share with someone. So are babies. If you are willing to share one, you should be ready to share the other. If you’re not ready to share BOTH, then you are hurting yourself by allowing dishonesty.
My oldest daughter was given a “NEVER SETTLE” ring by her older cousin. It’s a powerful message and I am grateful that someone a little older and wiser gifted my daughter with that wisdom.

]]> By: Bethany http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6183 Bethany Fri, 02 May 2008 09:03:07 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6183 I love, love, love that you're writing this series, and I'm hoping it stretches out into many more thousands of words. My preschool daughters are still too young to learn the details of sex, but I've been teaching them things about our bodies as the topics arise, and I'm realizing I'm going to have to get my sexual philosophy worked out pretty quickly. I know these things for sure: I want my girls to view sex as natural and beautiful, never taboo or shameful. I want them to discuss it openly with me and with their future partners. I want them to feel confident in their bodies and expressions of love. I want them to be well-educated on their "inner workings" (both physical and emotional) and the details of birth control, hygiene, and pregnancy. These things I'm not so sure on: Is abstinence until marriage really the best option for committed couples? (My husband and I waited until our wedding day, but I often wished--and still do --that we hadn't waited on a ceremony and a culturally-approved date to fully express our love.) If I forego abstinence training and teach my girls to give sex to anyone they love, does that mean they will lose their virginity at 14 to some punk they feel in love with? But if I do teach them to be abstinent, will they feel that sex is wrong or be too embarrassed to talk to me about it--or worse, have sex without protection or parental support? I'm so glad that my husband is the only person I have ever shared my body with, and I want my girls to have the same feeling one day (no regrets), but I definitely don't want them to have all the baggage I do on the subject. Thanks for keeping this discussion alive. It's definitely giving me food for thought, and I'm hoping to find some clarity in it. I love, love, love that you’re writing this series, and I’m hoping it stretches out into many more thousands of words. My preschool daughters are still too young to learn the details of sex, but I’ve been teaching them things about our bodies as the topics arise, and I’m realizing I’m going to have to get my sexual philosophy worked out pretty quickly.

I know these things for sure: I want my girls to view sex as natural and beautiful, never taboo or shameful. I want them to discuss it openly with me and with their future partners. I want them to feel confident in their bodies and expressions of love. I want them to be well-educated on their “inner workings” (both physical and emotional) and the details of birth control, hygiene, and pregnancy.

These things I’m not so sure on: Is abstinence until marriage really the best option for committed couples? (My husband and I waited until our wedding day, but I often wished–and still do –that we hadn’t waited on a ceremony and a culturally-approved date to fully express our love.) If I forego abstinence training and teach my girls to give sex to anyone they love, does that mean they will lose their virginity at 14 to some punk they feel in love with? But if I do teach them to be abstinent, will they feel that sex is wrong or be too embarrassed to talk to me about it–or worse, have sex without protection or parental support? I’m so glad that my husband is the only person I have ever shared my body with, and I want my girls to have the same feeling one day (no regrets), but I definitely don’t want them to have all the baggage I do on the subject.

Thanks for keeping this discussion alive. It’s definitely giving me food for thought, and I’m hoping to find some clarity in it.

]]> By: Jennifer http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6172 Jennifer Fri, 02 May 2008 06:08:02 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6172 Rachelle, I love so much of what you have written here. I have seen your love for your girls and think its really neat to see how that love is expressed without fear when it comes to their sexuality. Here is my friendly push-back though...I am not sure that we, as humans or as society, are well served when sex is disconnected from the creation of life. Do we lose something when sex is mainly for pleasure and the possibility of new life is scientifically removed by taking a pill or something else? I dont have any answers, just lots of questions. I think I want my son to know that sex is something to enjoy with someone he loves...but I also want him to have a sense that it is connected to the creation of life, and how powerful that is. I'm just not sure I want to take that away by overly-normalizing birth control. I want my son to enjoy being a sexual person in ALL that it means, including the power to create new life. And that would mean putting off sex until adulthood (where he could support that new life) and/or marriage. Sex is wonderful, and it is fun, but its not *just* a toy or opportunity for connection - it means something far earthier, and far messier, and far more life-affirming than that. I might be nuts on this one :-) But, I've always had mixed feelings about birth control and how it disconnects from life and the Earth. Rachelle,

I love so much of what you have written here. I have seen your love for your girls and think its really neat to see how that love is expressed without fear when it comes to their sexuality.

Here is my friendly push-back though…I am not sure that we, as humans or as society, are well served when sex is disconnected from the creation of life. Do we lose something when sex is mainly for pleasure and the possibility of new life is scientifically removed by taking a pill or something else? I dont have any answers, just lots of questions.

I think I want my son to know that sex is something to enjoy with someone he loves…but I also want him to have a sense that it is connected to the creation of life, and how powerful that is. I’m just not sure I want to take that away by overly-normalizing birth control.

I want my son to enjoy being a sexual person in ALL that it means, including the power to create new life. And that would mean putting off sex until adulthood (where he could support that new life) and/or marriage. Sex is wonderful, and it is fun, but its not *just* a toy or opportunity for connection – it means something far earthier, and far messier, and far more life-affirming than that.

I might be nuts on this one :-) But, I’ve always had mixed feelings about birth control and how it disconnects from life and the Earth.

]]> By: Josh http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6162 Josh Fri, 02 May 2008 03:16:46 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6162 Funny, I just saw this on the Daily Show by John Stewart yesterday: http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=167331&title=the-global-war-in-your-pants Thought I would throw this in. Funny, I just saw this on the Daily Show by John Stewart yesterday:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=167331&title=the-global-war-in-your-pants

Thought I would throw this in.

]]> By: Katie http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6137 Katie Thu, 01 May 2008 20:03:47 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6137 I'm 23 years old and very far from having children and having to tell them about sex. But I grew up in a conservative evangelical Christian home, and don't ascribe to those beliefs anymore, and am still figuring out how I AM going to live. Thanks for helping me to mold my new worldview. Your thoughts on sexuality matter to me, and I'm looking forward to reading what else you have to say. I’m 23 years old and very far from having children and having to tell them about sex.

But I grew up in a conservative evangelical Christian home, and don’t ascribe to those beliefs anymore, and am still figuring out how I AM going to live. Thanks for helping me to mold my new worldview. Your thoughts on sexuality matter to me, and I’m looking forward to reading what else you have to say.

]]> By: Rachelle http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6122 Rachelle Thu, 01 May 2008 17:18:25 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6122 Tandiana, Excellent! Those are good things to teach about sex -- wether you choose to teach your kids that any sex before marriage at any age is inappropriate; or if you choose to teach your kids that sex before marriage can be appropriate and healthy. Either way, the information your parents gave you about risks and consquences are essential. I wonder though, if you can teach total abstinence as the ONLY appropirate/moral/Godly way to exsist as a sexual being in a way that would be healthy (and not guilt or shame producing) to all everyone. It's the absolutism and the universialism that concerns me But teaching abstinence as one option among others is important, and can be very validating to those who do chose to abstain all the way until marriage (if they marry), or until they feel 'ready.' Thanks for your helpful input. It seem that creating a relationship with your children that allows for open, honest and not too uncomfortable discourse around the topic is one of the essential elements of nurturing healthy sexuality. Your folks did well, no? Tandiana,

Excellent! Those are good things to teach about sex — wether you choose to teach your kids that any sex before marriage at any age is inappropriate; or if you choose to teach your kids that sex before marriage can be appropriate and healthy. Either way, the information your parents gave you about risks and consquences are essential.

I wonder though, if you can teach total abstinence as the ONLY appropirate/moral/Godly way to exsist as a sexual being in a way that would be healthy (and not guilt or shame producing) to all everyone. It’s the absolutism and the universialism that concerns me But teaching abstinence as one option among others is important, and can be very validating to those who do chose to abstain all the way until marriage (if they marry), or until they feel ‘ready.’

Thanks for your helpful input. It seem that creating a relationship with your children that allows for open, honest and not too uncomfortable discourse around the topic is one of the essential elements of nurturing healthy sexuality. Your folks did well, no?

]]> By: Shelley http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6119 Shelley Thu, 01 May 2008 16:54:34 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6119 I remain grateful for your ability to start and sustain conversations about how we move through the world... and how we help our children to think about their own journey. Thank you. I remain grateful for your ability to start and sustain conversations about how we move through the world… and how we help our children to think about their own journey. Thank you.

]]> By: Monica http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6112 Monica Thu, 01 May 2008 15:36:41 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6112 OH, Rachelle! Thank you for ALL of this! I'm totally looking forward to the conversation and more posts on this topic. I don't actually have time to really read this post now, or in the coming days as we're leaving our computer at home for the weekend ... all by itself. :) But when I get back, I'll read this more carefully and make an offering to the conversation. Thanks!!!!! OH, Rachelle! Thank you for ALL of this! I’m totally looking forward to the conversation and more posts on this topic. I don’t actually have time to really read this post now, or in the coming days as we’re leaving our computer at home for the weekend … all by itself. :) But when I get back, I’ll read this more carefully and make an offering to the conversation.

Thanks!!!!!

]]> By: Elaine http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6111 Elaine Thu, 01 May 2008 15:34:00 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6111 The first blog post I read today, and I suspect the best piece of writing I will read today or tomorrow about sex, or another complex, controversial topic. I'll read the next 10, 000 words you write. Don't be concerned about a long post. How can you examine and discuss a topic like this in a few short paragraphs? I'm still processing so I don't have very specific comments -- yet -- but after first reading, I'm thinking this writing is very thoughtful, very compelling, very respectful, and very wise. Thank you, Rachelle. The first blog post I read today, and I suspect the best piece of writing I will read today or tomorrow about sex, or another complex, controversial topic. I’ll read the next 10, 000 words you write. Don’t be concerned about a long post. How can you examine and discuss a topic like this in a few short paragraphs? I’m still processing so I don’t have very specific comments — yet — but after first reading, I’m thinking this writing is very thoughtful, very compelling, very respectful, and very wise. Thank you, Rachelle.

]]> By: Tandaina http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/comment-page-1/#comment-6109 Tandaina Thu, 01 May 2008 14:48:14 +0000 http://www.magpie-girl.com/20080501/abstinence-kids-and-faith-thoughts-from-the-comment-gallery/#comment-6109 Lots of good thoughts here but just a quick addition: <i>Is there a way to teach abstinence until marriage that would not carry with it a subtext of shame and guilt? Here I’d like to proffer a fairly clear opinion. No, there isn’t.</i> Why in heaven's name not? Its not about shame and guilt. Two different approaches come to mind. 1. My parents were very up front about the risks involved in sex. I knew that there is NO such thing as entirely safe sex (my Mom got pregnant with me while using two forms of birth control, oops!) and my parents explained very clearly what the consequences of sex could be: both STDs (I grew up at the height of the AIDS scare) and pregnancy. They gave me the information and by the way they raised me the choice became quite simply a logical one. I had plans, places to go things to do. I wanted an education, a career, etc, etc, etc. All things I found more important than the pleasure of sex when weighed against the risks involved in sex before marriage. I went through high school, college without even being tempted. I knew what I wanted, I had weighed my options, I made my choice. It was never about shame it was about consequences. Is the experience worth the potential consequences? For me the answer was <i>no</i>. End of story. 2. Second option (not what my parents took, they're scientists) is to instill from an early age the sacred gift that sex is. To teach its spiritual and emotional aspects and its incredible gift of the creation of new life. Huge responsibility comes with that sacred gift and it is not to be taken lightly. You aren't teaching that its shameful you are teaching that its too holy to enter into lightly. If I ever choose to have children I would probably use a both/and approach of the two above. Just another perspective. Tandaina Lots of good thoughts here but just a quick addition:

Is there a way to teach abstinence until marriage that would not carry with it a subtext of shame and guilt? Here I’d like to proffer a fairly clear opinion. No, there isn’t.

Why in heaven’s name not? Its not about shame and guilt. Two different approaches come to mind.

1. My parents were very up front about the risks involved in sex. I knew that there is NO such thing as entirely safe sex (my Mom got pregnant with me while using two forms of birth control, oops!) and my parents explained very clearly what the consequences of sex could be: both STDs (I grew up at the height of the AIDS scare) and pregnancy. They gave me the information and by the way they raised me the choice became quite simply a logical one. I had plans, places to go things to do. I wanted an education, a career, etc, etc, etc. All things I found more important than the pleasure of sex when weighed against the risks involved in sex before marriage. I went through high school, college without even being tempted. I knew what I wanted, I had weighed my options, I made my choice. It was never about shame it was about consequences. Is the experience worth the potential consequences? For me the answer was no. End of story.

2. Second option (not what my parents took, they’re scientists) is to instill from an early age the sacred gift that sex is. To teach its spiritual and emotional aspects and its incredible gift of the creation of new life. Huge responsibility comes with that sacred gift and it is not to be taken lightly. You aren’t teaching that its shameful you are teaching that its too holy to enter into lightly.

If I ever choose to have children I would probably use a both/and approach of the two above. Just another perspective.

Tandaina

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